Hello everybody here!

Stumbled into this blog just today: how incredibly refreshing to find other MIDI users looking for simple, straightforward MIDI editors/sequencers just as I do.

Sure enough, I also had a big love for the Atari ST (also owned a Falcon): everything was clear and solid with it. But, unbelievably, so many efforts have been wasted in order to turn a perfectly good musical system into a nightmare: innumerable software houses (many of which simply vanished after a few years) have tried to convince users into adopting their own crazy concoctions. Money, money, money...

Well, here's my 2 cents: there's been one really good sequencer/editor for the PC in the 2000's, namely Jazz++, which had many fantastic possibilities... without obliging anyone to even notice them!
It was my workhorse for years, way before the "Soundfont Era", and it's a real pity that nobody succeeded into perfecting a newer version; it does still run fine on Win$ 7 (haven't tried on Win$ 10).
Look around for Jazz++NT, the last official version; I haven't tried compiling it myself.

Another interesting (and actively maintained) program is SynthFont, which allows playing any MIDI track with a different Soundfont file. Sadly, it is rather slow and tricky as an editor...

And several years ago there was MidiSwing, a tiny JavaRunTime program which, at least, offered simple MIDIfile editing and playback with no hassle; it can still be found somewhere, but seems mostly abandoned by its original French developers.
No matter what Operating System you're using, once you have JavaRunTime installed you can run it -- I ran it under Puppy Linux without problems.

Now I'd like to test Sekaiju and Helio... Hints anyone?

All the best to everybody!

capoverde.

I have been using Passport's Master Tracks Pro for over twenty years now. It is the best and easiest stand alone sequencer application I have ever found.
I make tracks for 3 different bands and many people say the tracks sound very much like a real live band.
There is nothing it cannot do and do it easily.

In general the problem is more related with the design of the computer motherboards than with the software itself.

It could happen the paradox that a 15 years old (or more) motherboard with an old OS like Windows 98SE, an old MIDI interface like an MQX32 and any old sequencer could have a much more better timing and timestamping that any of the new computers with Intel i7 or Xeon processors.

This old computers could access directly to the hardware instead of accesing to a virtualized abstraction layers, the cost was that when they fail it was a complete catastrophe and you lose all your work.

This is a problem of the HARDWARE design of the motherboards related with the packetized internal comunication of the data in the PCIe buses.

I still have an Atari plus software which I use to play very old Cubase .ARR files. I sympathise with your problem to some extent, but I have also been using the more recent versions of Cubase for some years and haven't had any timing issues. Maybe you should consider whether your other equipment is causing latency. Possibly your arrangements are very big -- in that case it's hard for any software to cope perfectly.
I use an outboard interface and Roland hardware synths for the vast majority of my stuff, and my Mac Mini seems to run it all with no problems, as did my Vaio PC laptop a couple of years ago. I also record some tracks on an outboard recorder and import them.
The latest Cubase has an arrangement list feature that is like the one on the old Pro 24 for Atari, only better.
There is an inherent timing issue with software metronomes, but that exists on the Atari as well and is much less noticeable on my present system.

For Windows, I have always been happy with Voyetras' Digital Orchestrator (formerly Midi Orchestrator). It wasn't free, but it was a professionally developed suite from time where there wasn't any space for bloatware. It might be quite tricky to get hold of it and get it running nowadays, but checking whether I can do that would be my first choice if I had to come up with a sequencer.

Sekaiju, Frinika for MIDI Sequencing and Musescore for MIDI notation. For a free DAW (Digital Audio Workstation including MIDI, use Tracktion 5.

Sekaiju

Frinika

Musescore

Tracktion 5

Don't be afraid to take the time to learn a little of the bloat, perhaps what you are calling bloat are advanced features that can be usefull.

I happen to love Anvil Studio by Willow Software! It's free, but you can't do much with it unless you buy the accessory "Pro-Mix". I'm just suggesting it and throwing it out there as an option so please don't hurt me if it's a bad choice!

Have a look at MidiYodi which was originally written to examine (and listen to MIDI files) but has evolved over time with editing capabilities and as we speak (or at least as I write ;-) a new version will be out (MidiYodi 3.2) end of August that includes note editing in a Keyboard like viewer.

http://www.canato.se/midiyodi

Have you tried Sekaiju (made in Japan, but comes with an English translation) or Anvil Studio (free for the basic product but with paid for upgrades (to add bloat ;-) ).

Perhaps like you, I started on an Atari ST.
I was able to write a program to download, edit parameters and then upload memory dumps from a Yamaha HS6 organ.

I have appreciated peoples replies . I have not found anything so far to be of use. It is quite tricky as I seem to have limited time to make music and I am lucky enough to have people wanting tracks off me. Seq 24 looks great , but I just don't seem to be able to work with it successfully. I will persevere with it as time allows.
The Ataris where ten times better than any of the modern bullshit sequencers.

another oops, talked about what to do with a sequencer instead of the good sequencer without bloatware you are looking for. Package - Editor

opps, forgot the link to Reascript, REaper, ReaScript

In Reaper, there is an API that is written in Python, although here is a page that lists the languages that "extends" Reaper and has links to the manuals, but if you look into ReaScript, that's where one would start to find the path that links Python to MIDI to FXs/plug-ins of tracks. It is difficult to quantify what bloated means, as it could be different between myself and anyone else. As far as size on disc, Reaper's install folder is about 66.4 MB in Windows 8 Professional.

Oh yeah, the Reaper JS: MIDI Sequencer Megababy has some type of piano roll feature in it, the only thing about that plugin is a limitation on the range of notes playable, but there may another sequencer plug-in for Reaper that I haven't read about yet.

In your originally post, I didn't think that I found which operation-system you are using. In a subsequent post, I found that you mentioned Ubuntu (Reaper works in 32/64 bit OSX/Windows (I am not sure how far back in the OS versions it goes though). These programs I am listing are not able to work in Ubuntu without the Wine-emulator. Unless something changed as of this writing, Reaper is most compatible with Wine (when compared to Audition 3), Wine Rating on Reaper 5.x, I would avoid Audition 3.0 all together though. Audition 3 cost like $350, Reaper is either $60 or $225, Info on Reapers Licensing costs.

I used Audition 3.0 in the past. I am not sure about the piano key roll edit feature though in Audition 3.0 ( I stopped using Audition 3 back in 2011 for Reaper). There are a couple of things I didn't like about Audition 3 (maybe more, I just don't recall the others right now); not being able to select multiple tracks at once, 32-bit. Here is a link to the manual Adobe Audition 3.0 Manual Download in PDF, MIDI Sequencer is Chapter 10.. I think that in order to obtain a copy, one would have to initiate a license transfer from a current holder (I am pretty sure the license is Perpetual on Audition 3, not this whole Creative Cloud subscription model), Adobe is no longer selling licenses to Audition 3.0, and I am pretty sure Audition CC doesn't have a MIDI Sequencer in it added back into it though (they rebuilt Audition in 64-bit, and not all the features have made it back from the previous 32-bit version).

As far as Reaper goes, here is a link to a discussion about MIDI Sequencing in Reaper, Reaper MIDI Sequencers, with some slight variations on other topics in Reaper. Another plug-in for Reaper is on this page, Js: MIDI Sequencer Megababy and other versions, I'd really look into Reaper for ideas. I tested it out (just visually, no sound) and watched some videos, and read some about the availability of features, I think there is probably even away to programmatically access parts of the MIDI Sequencers with Javascript, or even C or C++, or Python (I'd have to get back to you on that as I'd have to reread somethings that I am not able to get back into right now.). One could even start working with the Actions panel with the SWS Extensions to really have some stored macros with all the JS (Javascript) plugins that come with Reaper. I am not positive, but thought at least I'd mention that there is probably a path between Python and the Actions section to use midi to trigger active VSTi or other effects/plug-ins that a MIDI track/file is using.

I apologize for any errors or typos. I hope this post helps. At least this offers some more options to look into.

If you prefer to write notation, check out Noteworthy Composer.

brandon wrote:

I have been using midi for many years and I am one of many who really miss the Atari for its ease of use ,as a result of its basic but powerful midi only sequencing.
I would pay good money to have a simple rock solid sequencer that had no bloatware /No latency/ no silly softsynths etc
It seems we are forced to buy software with 90 percent more on it than we need. Ableton. Reason. Cubase etc […]

Piano roll Key Edit. Horizontal track layout out . Is it really that much to be asking for? […]

I share the same feeling. By the way, I tried Seq24 which was suggested in this thread, and did not like it neither: unstable (crashes on Ubuntu) and not intuitive).

You mentioned Atari I never used (I was too young at that time) and you mentioned piano roll: have you investigated in trackers? It's a bit similar to piano roll in some way, except it's displayed vertically and there is no bar to show note length. I remember I tried something named MadTracker (however, I don't remember why I ended to give up with it … may be because it was not easy to insert notes). May be you can give it a try: http://www.madtracker.org/about.php

If you have some kind of specifications in mind for what would be a good MIDI editor to you, please, tell, I'm interested in knowing it. I'm planning to try to create a low cost MIDI authoring application in the future (no planned date, as for now, I'm busy with RenderMan … something about animation).

Well, I too find modern DAW software over bloated too.

So, I'm still using software from way back called XGworks, by Yamaha.
Designed way back in the late nineties, it was upgraded to XGworks ST in 2003, but with the acquisition of Steinberg, was never sold in the West.
I managed to pick up a copy from the Japanese Yahoo auction site a few weeks back and I'm gradually translating the .chm help files to English.
Many of the help files that came with SQ01, which was free with certain Yamaha synths a while back, are relevant.

Although all the set up files are in Japanese, it loads 98% in English, and works okay on Windows 7.
Too much bloat in Windows 8 and 10.

qtractor, ardour

Excuse spelling errors in the above. There doesn't seem to be a
way to edit posts?